Forwarding MIDI from USB to MIDI-OUT [NOW WORKING]

[Codeman]

Hi @ll,

I have my Axoloti now for some month but had no time to use it - until now! I want to manage a (perhaps) strange setup:

MIDI-USB -> [USB-MIDI-Axoloti -> [???] -> MIDI-OUT-Axoloti]->external_MIDI_Arpeggiator->[MIDI-IN-Axoloti->Axoloti-Patch->...]

In words:
I want to use my small AKAI-MPK25-USB-MIDI keyboard connected to the Axoloti, but want to trigger Axoloti-patches via my external MIDI-Arpeggiator. How can this be arranged? I don't know what object to use for "[???]" in my simple circuit above and how to tell the patch to get the MIDI input from the DIN-MIDI in (instead of USB-MIDI).

I tried a little bit with some objects I found, but couldn't get it to work. Perhaps someone has a working patch or a hint where I can learn from?

Thanks, Holger

[thetechnobear]

you can use the midithru to send the input to output
(or you could do this thru patching midi/in objects to out in a subpatch to filter, see below)

to 'filter' which source (din or usb) , you need to create a subpatch, and the on the patch settings select 'midi selector' , this allows you choose midi channels, and also midi source (din/ubs device/usb host) for input

personally, seems a faff though, why not write an arp in Axoloti... then you don't have to mess about sending midi to an external box

(there might be an arp in the community library, ive not looked...)

[Codeman]

Hi @thetechnobear

you can use the midithru to send the input to output(or you could do this thru patching midi/in objects to out in a subpatch to filter, see below)

to 'filter' which source (din or usb) , you need to create a subpatch, and the on the patch settings select 'midi selector' , this allows you choose midi channels, and also midi source (din/ubs device/usb host) for input

Ok, thanks for the fast answer! I will try to learn what a subpatch is

personally, seems a faff though, why not write an arp in Axoloti... then you don't have to mess about sending midi to an external box

Oh yes - there seems to be some Arpeggiators - but I need tha haptic of my hardware arpeggiator

Regards, Holger

[Codeman]

Hm... I think I have understand how subpatches are working. Also there seems to be a nice object ready for use without creating a subpatch: tb/midi/utils/midithru

I can see that there are MIDI events redirected from USB to DIN-MIDI-OUT. My external Arpeggiator gets triggered. But how can I get DIN-MIDI-IN? When using midi/in/keyb it recognizes also the USB MIDI events. I need an object which only reads MIDI-IN from DIN-MIDI-IN. Is there such an object?

Regards, Holger

[lokki]

But how can I get DIN-MIDI-IN? When using midi/in/keyb it recognizes also the USB MIDI events. I need an object which only reads MIDI-IN from DIN-MIDI-IN. Is there such an object?

as @thetechnobear already suggested, use a subpatch for that. when you load it in the main patch you will get a selector where you can choose the midi source from.

[Codeman]

Hi @lokki

I think I have some problems to get this running... I am absolute new to Axoloti - also not new to synth programming...

1. I started with a blank patch and added "midi/in/keyb"
2. Unselected the object and click on the menu "View/Settings"
3. Checked "Has MIDI selector"
4. Stored as AXS.
5. Created a new patch and added my precreated subpatch.

Now I see a MIDI selector box - but how to connect anything what makes sound? There are no connectors...

I think my biggest problem is the lack of a manual which takes me to the right direction... anyone who can tell me what I am doing wrong?

Thanks, Holger

[lokki]

there are two options here.

either add your sound-generating objects into the subpatch and then add a red outlet to connect your audio signal to the main patch. (this outlet will then be visible on the main patch as a connection point on the subpatch box. connect this to an output and you should hear something

or you add a blue outlet right after the keyb object and make your sound-generating stuff in the main patch, connecting the blue outlet to an oscillator in the main patch for example.

hope this helps.

[Codeman]

or you add a blue outlet right after the keyb object and make your sound-generating stuff in the main patch, connecting the blue outlet to an oscillator in the main patch for example.

Many thanks!!! That was my missing link ! Now I have:

My external Arpeggiator gets MIDI data and sends also MIDI to the Axoloti, but the Axoloti produces no sound Do you have any idea what is going wrong?

Regards, Holger

[lokki]

couple of questions:

if you receive from omni and send to din, you might get a midi loop, no?

i would try your patch with a simple setup like a midi-keyboard connected directly to the axo. does it work then? well then it is most obviously an error with the midi connections (filtering, loops etc.)

I want to use my small AKAI-MPK25-USB-MIDI keyboard connected to the Axoloti, but want to trigger Axoloti-patches via my external MIDI-Arpeggiator. How can this be arranged? I don't know what object to use for "[???]" in my simple circuit above and how to tell the patch to get the MIDI input from the DIN-MIDI in (instead of USB-MIDI).

from your original post i would:

create a subpatch set to usb-midi which contains the midithru object (so as to filter out any midi messages arriving at the din-midi of axoloti)

create a second subpatch receiving din-midi and doing your sound-generation (like you already did)

hope this helps

[Codeman]

Thanks @lokki!

if you receive from omni and send to din, you might get a midi loop, no?

No. In fact the arpeggiator only gets data when setting to omni or (I think that's the better solution) setting to usb host port 1.

i would try your patch with a simple setup like a midi-keyboard connected directly to the axo. does it work then? well then it is most obviously an error with the midi connections (filtering, loops etc.)

Simple patches are working out of the box with my USB MIDI keyboard.

create a subpatch set to usb-midi which contains the midithru object (so as to filter out any midi messages arriving at the din-midi of axoloti)

create a second subpatch receiving din-midi and doing your sound-generation (like you already did)

Ok, I have tried this:

But nothing changed: I can see my MIDI-IN and MIDI-OUT LEDs on the arpeggiator flashing, so the MIDI-forward from USB-MIDI to DIN-MIDI-OUT seems to work. But the 2nd subpatch which should get all MIDI data from MIDI-DIN-IN seems not to work. If I set the mididevice to usbhost in my MIDI_IN subpatch I get some sound...

I will double check my MIDI cable an arpeggiattor... perhaps there is a problem...

Regards, Holger

[Codeman]

I will double check my MIDI cable an arpeggiattor... perhaps there is a problem...

Hm - both are working. Seems to be a problem with using MIDI-IN only for DIN.

Regards, Holger

[thetechnobear]

sorry, I'm not quite following.. are you saying your not getting any input over DIN, when filtering by DIN?
its working fine for me here, try the attached patch...
mididin.axp (3.1 KB)

can you check you have marked your subpatch as mono.

basically you should simplify your patch down to the simplest it can be, whilst still exhibiting the problem, then you can post it here... e.g.. it does it work when you dont have the midi formard object?

also preferably check the midi din input with a simple keyboard... (when you post your patch, that will be the first thing i do )

[Codeman]

Thanks @thetechnobear

I tried your midiin.axp in combination with the midithru - checked my subpatch is mono. I also carried my old DX7 from the rehearsal room back home, so I tried to trigger sounds via DIN. Also testes a loop with a DIN coupler. This is my setup (the red box is the Axoloti, the blinking toy in the background is ARPIE):

Here are my results:

• DIN input works.
• midithru (USB->DIN) also works (I can see incoming (and outgoing) data on my arpeggiator).
• The arpeggiator works (tested with the DX7).
• putting a loop (with the DIN coupler) on the Axoloti, triggering by USB: works, too.

BUT: connecting the arpeggiator to Axoloti DIN no sound is produced.

So I think the problem maybe different electrical levels on the MIDI line. I had such a problem with a Roland interface and a synth some time ago... very strange and difficult to solve.

This is the patch (mostly taken from yours):
midi-thru-in.axp (3.5 KB)

Anyone who had discovered same problems with different hardware?

Regards, Holger

[thetechnobear]

So I think the problem maybe different electrical levels on the MIDI line. I had such a problem with a Roland interface and a synth some time ago... very strange and difficult to solve.

so if you forget everything else, and just connect the ARPIE to axoloti (DIN IN) , and create a patch with
midi/in/montor... are you saying, no messages are coming thru?

if so, then either its electrical issue or malformed midi messages with the ARPIE.

ive tried a few devices with MIDI DIN into axo and had no issues.

[Codeman]

so if you forget everything else, and just connect the ARPIE to axoloti (DIN IN) , and create a patch with
midi/in/montor... are you saying, no messages are coming thru?

Ok - midi/in/monitor is new for me

I will take a look at this. Going on vacation tomorrow. Will test this when being back.

Thanks, Holger

[Codeman]

Hi @thetechnobear, @lokki,

back from holidays I put together my equipment and tried again. Surprise: It works out of the box as you described some artcles before !!! Took everything downstairs to my home-studio: No - nothing happens. After some deeper investigations I found that one of the MIDI cables has a problem -> loose connection, but only sometimes: AAAAAAAAAARGH !!!!!

I took the side-cutter and cutted the cable into halfs.

Thanks for helping - now everything works fine. Now the fun starts! I will post my simple working setup the next days here - for documentation purposes.

Regards, Holger

[andybutler]

Hi,
sorry if this is a dumb question.
I can't find midithru.axo anywhere.
I can find midiled.axo in
axoloti-contrib\objects\tb\midi\utils

Would be great to have that object even as it is.
What I'd imagine doing is to incorporate zoning into it.
i.e split output onto different channels based on Note number, and have the capacity to shift the octave of each channel.
...well probably only need to split into 2 zones.

From what I've seen so far of the Ax environment, I'm thinking I can do that just with scripting.

Perhaps make the object configurable by adding parameters to it...

anyway, a pointer to finding midithru.axo would be cool.